That guy is a complete arsehole, just wanting to show how brave he is like most people on documentaries these days. I really hate what has become of wildlife programmes, this guy is on everyday on discovery channel, usually showing him killing some wild animal so he can eat it like a primitive cave man. I even saw one of his shows where he killed an ate a tortoise, like he really needs that to survive when he will be staying in a 5 star hotel the same night. I really hate these kind of people who have are always on TV now, I will always prefer the David Attenborough approach to documentary making!
 

I see this more and more on these ''survival''shows. Although in some regions the Boa is a invasive species that should be killed on sight (although as far as I've heard), other snakes are a victim to these so called suvivalists. I believe that most people are still afraid of snakes so killing one will give you more points than to leave it in peace.
I used to watch these shows and at first I thought oke.. 1 snake.. But other shows tend to do this to get some action in the show at the cost of some amazing wildlife! Nowadays I don't even watch it anymore because it is almost a certain that a snake will be found and gets killed to be eaten...

Disrespectfull if you ask me...

I don't know if there is any action initiated to stop these killings. It would indeed be a good plan to start one! 

now there is another one www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlVNHw01TYQ

F***!!! what's wrong with Discovery channel!!!??

I'm wondering how many kids killed something in the wildlife after watching this sick show... 

Check this out as well, the venom hunter Donald Schultz collects snakes from all over the world to put them in a glass house and he lives with them for some time. What's up with that? To collect animals from the wild for something as stupid as this?

www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARzK6Y48scI&feature=channel

more:

http://animal.discovery.com/tv/wild-recon/donald-schultz/how-venom-in-vegas-works.html

"this isn't a stunt, it's my job"
Keep telling yourself that darling... 

This is a discussion I have often held at work, with friends and with family who do not always understand why someone can have a hobby like herpetofauna or terrarium-keeping.
They see these kinds of shows and are asking themselves (and me) if that is normal.
I always say NO! It is too stupid to put in words why there should be any reason to kill these animals, only for high listings of the programs.
Because let’s say it upfront: Anybody who is in nature and making a show about it with cameras and equipment can also carry a simple bag with some survival-candybars and drinks. There is no excuse for killing the animals.
In a real life scenario it’s different, but that is not the case!

On the other hand: the work and research of The Venom Hunter is a good one. And the glass house episode was about raising funds, public awareness and interest for the research of venom and the possibilities for medicines. But I guess that was also possible without captured snakes…

It’s a thin line in wildlife shows and survival shows, but I still prefer the ones where the animals are the main figures and not the ones to be killed.
 

I've not watched the clip but are we talking about Bear Grylls, cos he is a total tit, in one show coming from North Africa he bit the head off a frog and then spat it out, whats the point?, in another he found a crab and said "i may as well put it out of its misery" it wasn't in any misery until you turned up you t***. Hopefully one of his stunts will go wrong sooner rather than later. 

It's not only with reptiles, the guy teaches to his viewers how to kill any wild animal, by actually killing it in front of the camera for no particular reason, while laughing. How the f*** did we come to this point? It is supposed there are animal rights and laws! where are they now? 

That Donald Schultz is another complete idiot. When I was in Costa Rica at a site I cannot mention he had been filming there only a short time before I arrived. Apparently he found a Bushmaster near my friends garden and was totally disrespectful with the snake which is generally quite docile but of course extremely venomous. I believe the snake ended up being taken away for whatever reason by him and his crew....
I hate what has become of documentaries, as much as people have a go at Austin Stevens he is at least respectful with the animals and genuinely cares about them. Schultz just does it to look like an action man and has no passion for wildlife from what I have seen. 

well, we can start a letter in which we ask for a stop on the killing and which we can sign.

I drafted a beginning, something like:


To the board of directors of Discovery Channel / Animal Planet

Dear all,

We would like to ask you to reconsider the way of broadcasting several survival-programms were for no reason wildlife is being killed.

We understand that in real life situations man have to hunt and kill for a living and survival, but as long there is a camerateam, there is the possibility for food and drinks to be provided.
The difference between the programms showing how to kill animals on Discovery Channel and on the other hand how to protect and resque the same animals on Animal Planet is really weird…

For excample: ask yourself why you broadcast a serie like the Whale Wars were the Japanese fleet is discussed for killing whales for food. For the same reason it is also questionable why the animals in the suvivalshows are killed...

For this reason we are asking you for a stop regarding the killing of animals in the survival-shows. We cannot think about one legitime reason why this has to happen, so it has to be for higher listings of the series, and that is unacceptable!

 

I agree but want it more aggressive and add somehow that this kind of images promote killing of wild animals to young people, and the act itself is against animal rights and laws. My english are bad so someone else has to write this in the right way.

Look the guy just laughs on it, shows no respect to the animal www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8qMr7Js8e0&feature=related

 

I believe that taking up a more aggressive approacht would harm our credibility. I would like to do the same Ilias but I believe that would not be wise.

Maybe setting up a petition could help our cause. Including the text that was already set up might be enough to trigger something? 

I don't mean curses or insults, just defending animal rights stronger and speak about the impact this show could have on children and teenagers. A petition was in my mind, yes.
Can anyone add those things to the text so we start a petition? 

second draft, please feel free to amend:

Dear all,

We would like to ask you to reconsider the way of broadcasting several survival-programms were for no reason wildlife is being killed.
First question to ask is whether the kiling of the animals in those countries is legal in the first place….
We understand that in real life situations man have to hunt and kill for a living and survival, but as long there is a camerateam, there is the possibility for food and drinks to be provided.
The difference between the survival programms showing how to kill animals on Discovery Channel and on the other hand how to protect and resque the same animals on Animal Planet is really weird…

For excample: ask yourself why you broadcast a serie like the Whale Wars were the Japanese fleet is discussed for killing whales for food or the series of Steve Irwin, The Crocodile Hunter. In these shows the animal wellfare is important and efforts are made to protect wildlife and nature.
So why kill those animals in survival shows an hour later? Very, very questionable why the animals in the suvivalshows are killed...

As these shows can have a large impact on the behaviour of children towards the wildlife in their own environment, the killing and eating of wildlife should not be supported and/or broadcasted without a serious warning that these kind of extreme activities should not be imitated!

For these reasons we are asking you for a stop regarding the killing of animals in the survival-shows. We cannot think about one legitime reason why this has to happen, so it only has to be for higher listings of the series, and that is unacceptable!
 

I will just make my cosmetic suggestions :

The signatories of this petition would like to ask you to reconsider the content of material broadcasted by your channel. Several survival-programmes are depicting what seem to be real scenes where wildlife is being killed for sensational and dramatic effect.
First question to ask is whether the killing of the animals in those countries is legal in the first place….
We understand that in real life situations man has to hunt and kill for a living and survival, but as long there is a camera team, there is the possibility for food and drinks to be provided.
The difference between the survival programmes showing how to kill animals on Discovery Channel and on the other hand how to protect and rescue the same animals on Animal Planet is really weird…

For example: ask yourself why you broadcast a series like the Whale Wars were the Japanese fleet is discussed for killing whales for food or the series of Steve Irwin, The Crocodile Hunter. In these shows the animal welfare is important and efforts are made to protect wildlife and nature.
So why kill those animals in survival shows an hour later? Very, very questionable why the animals in the suvival shows are killed...

As these shows can have a large impact on the behaviour of children towards the wildlife in their own environment, the killing and eating of wildlife should not be supported and/or broadcasted without a serious warning that these kind of extreme activities should not be imitated!

For these reasons we are asking you to refrain from broadcasting shows promoting the killing of animals in the survival-shows. We cannot think about one legitimate reason for this has to happen, so it only has to be for higher listings of the series, and that is unacceptable!
 

I hate the animal killing in the survival-shows too and on top of that they do show bad other "survival-skills" as well, which can be dangerous for anyone who thinks he can learn something from these shows. 

Please check the text for any corrections so to start the campaign

"The signatories of this petition would like to ask you to reconsider the content of material broadcasted by your channel. Several survival-programmes are depicting what seem to be real scenes where wildlife is being killed for sensational and dramatic effect.
First question to ask is whether the killing of the animals in those countries is legal in the first place….
We understand that in real life situations man has to hunt and kill for a living and survival, but as long there is a camera team, there is the possibility for food and drinks to be provided.
The difference between the survival programs showing how to kill animals on Discovery Channel and on the other hand how to protect and rescue the same animals on Animal Planet is really weird…

Ask yourself why you broadcast a series like the Whale Wars were the Japanese fleet is discussed for killing whales for food or the series of Steve Irwin, The Crocodile Hunter. In these shows the animal welfare is important and efforts are made to protect wildlife and nature.
So why kill those animals in survival shows an hour later?

As these shows can have a large impact on the behavior of children towards the wildlife in their own environment, the killing and eating of wildlife should not be promoted and/or broadcasted.

For these reasons we are asking you to refrain from broadcasting shows promoting the killing of animals in the survival-shows. We cannot think about one legitimate reason for this has to happen, so it only has to be for higher listings of the series, and that is unacceptable!

We, the undersigned, are totally against shows that promote wild animal killing and show no respect to wildlife, so WE DEMAND THESE TV SHOWS TO STOP BROADCASTING!" 

Some more refinement:

"The signatories of this petition would like to ask you to reconsider the content of material broadcasted by your channel. Several 'survival' programmes are depicting what seem to be real scenes where wildlife is being killed for sensational and dramatic effect.
The first question to ask is whether the killing of the animals in those countries is legal in the first place….
We understand that in real life situations man has to hunt and kill for a living and survival, but as long there is a camera team, there is the possibility for food and drinks to be provided.
The difference between the survival programs showing how to kill animals on Discovery Channel and on the other hand how to protect and rescue the same animals on Animal Planet is really weird…

Ask yourself why you broadcast a series like the Whale Wars were the Japanese fleet is discussed for killing whales for food or the series of Steve Irwin, The Crocodile Hunter. In these shows the animal welfare is important and efforts are made to protect wildlife and nature.
So why kill those animals in survival shows an hour later?

As these shows can have a large impact on the behavior of children towards the wildlife in their own environment, the killing and eating of wildlife should not be promoted and/or broadcasted.

For these reasons we are asking you to refrain from broadcasting shows promoting the killing of animals in the survival-shows. We cannot think about one legitimate reason for this to happen, so it only has to be for higher ratings of the series, and that is unacceptable!

We, the undersigned, are totally against shows that promote wild animal killing and show no respect to wildlife, so WE DEMAND THESE TV SHOWS TO STOP BEING PRODUCED AND BROADCASTED!" 

I believe when being realistic that claiming that they should stop a program from being produced is a bit to far out there. Instead I would suggest you try to get them as far to not kill any animals in the show itself.

Just sharing my opinion.

Still think the initiative is excellent! 

I personally think that it is possible to stop those shows if they see that there are many people disturbed by this. They don't want to lose funs and audience.
I think the shooting of these shows has already ended, so the animals are already been killed anyway.
At least they will think twice for similar future shows. 

Bear Grylls was exposed as a fake in the Sunday Times way back on 22.07.2007.

I have no idea why he still gets shown on TV anywhere. 

Well, let me just conclude the situation:
All of you people are vegetarians, you never ever killed an animal, you never ever ate meat, you spend 99% of your time taking care for pigs, cows, chickens, and all that other type of animal that is kept under hilarious conditions because we like cheap sausage for lunch.
Sorry, we can talk about whether it is of use to show people how to "survive" because I think some of the shown things are dangerous - as was the croc hunter. But regarding that "useless" killing, I think most of the time he even eats what he is killing. So what exactly is the point? You see it on TV instead of hundreds of animals being killed by an "industrial butcher"?

I am typically not that kind of guy who compares bad things to other bad things just to mention that there have been 2 children dying from hunger during the time I wrote this. But I think the whole discussion here is way off.

Best and no hard feelings,
Michael 

1st of all, death is the same for all animals, snakes, pigs, humans, etc.
But here: the guy is NOT lost, there is no reason to kill wildlife which is not abundant at all, and the worst is that he affects children that will kill wildlife afterwards, just to "exercise" their survival skills, something they will never need to exercise: You don't have to be taught to learn you can grab a stick and kill something, you just know it. Have you seen the comments under those vids at youtube? they love him! He's their Rambo!

It's not that much about life or diet, it's more about wildlife. People need to learn how to protect it and not how to kill it. 

I disagree. Everyone is aware that he is not in danger.
Then how many people do you think go out and kill some random reptile that wouldn't have done that before? Just for the fun I mean. And now compare that number to the number of animals that are killed by road traffic, hunting, AND, in particular, by destruction of habitats.
I will even tell you the following: People do not need to know how to protect, people need to care. In my experience, people that start photographing start to care for nature. People that do Nordic walking, hiking, climbing, etc. sooner or later start to care. And, you may like that or not, people that care for survival care for nature that allows them to do the camping and snake killing. And from an overall point of view that is IMHO way more beneficial than the harm done by some idiots that might kill a reptile to eat it. Without more people caring, all the protection done by individuals and minor groups are sooner or later damned to fail. I don't like the croc hunter, but since that idiot is showing snakes and screams DANGER DANGER, many people at least do not only care for pandas, but also for reptiles.
I am drifting a bit away. To summarize, I think people are overracting here.

Best,
Micha 

Michael, I don't see why not to react to a bad thing just because there is something worse. My opinion is that we have to react at both bad and worse. Of course habitat loss is worse.

Plus I don't think this show will learn people to care, rather than "kill and laugh about it", and "who cares about that stupid things, their just food to me". 

Which implies you think that like the vast majority of people watching this show are brainless killing zombies or what? I saw several episodes of that show and I, sorry, never had the feeling or impression you describe. I think "the people" in general can very well judge the depicted situation in that show. With the same consequence, one should fight against all TV shows showing people buying cheap crap meat in the supermarket... :) In that show, things are visible and people can think about what the guy is doing. In the supermarket, everything is already packed for use, nice and shiny and people stop thinking about where the hell all that stuff comes from.
You are right, a bad thing is not OK just because there are worse things - that's what I tried to mention regarding the starvation thing. However, I am still not convinced this guy is really doing something one should complain about.at least not with the occasional killing for food. 

>Which implies you think that like the vast majority of people watching this show are brainless killing zombies or what? <

can you just read the comments of this video www.youtube.com/watch?v=53kVU6Jps9w ? You'll see what I mean.

If I cannot convince you, that's ok. You can stay off the petition :-) 

Michael,

I feel you are largely neglecting that a lot of kids see these shows and are the biggest fans. I can't see any good in growing up with images of idiots randomly killing animals. I think you should think about the (imho adverse) educational value of these shows. I'm not too bothered that one guy kills a snake and eats it, but showing it to a (young) audience, sets some kind of example on how to treat (wild) animals.

As such, I have to agree with your vegetarian remark. Clearly, I look at animals more as "populations" and do not share Ilias' concern for animal wellfare - I actually lost that in part thanks to studying biology...
 

I think you are neglecting the context of the show. Sure, it's not good that kids grow up with the picture of a guy killing a wild animal. Instead, lets let them grow up with their parents showing off the large deer that they just shot sitting on their fat asses in a hide orq catching a fish just for the sake of killing something. Or even better, let them grow up without any show on nature so they will never care.
The basic fact is that nowadays, one has to provide something exiting to interest people on TV. I hate the croc hunter and his way of working with "wild" animals. But one thing is for sure - he was capable of getting people's attention for nature and in that moment, he has done more than we as we spend our weekends aiming at protecting particular places from the ignorance of most people. In the discussed show, the idiot is showing people how to survive in the wild. I personally just watch it because of the nice places he visits and so do most people I know. Moreover, not all kids are brainless idiots. They grow up, get some education, and will hopefully learn how to rate what they see on TV. If you think that this is not true, we should be concerned about hunting, not killing snakes with a stick, not? What about all the fishing shows? Cook shows?
As said, one bad thing doesn't make another less bad. But IMHO, the discussed show has lots of potential to interest people for nature and in that context, I don't see the big thing in the shown killing. 

ready: http://www.euroherp.com/forum/subject/597/ 

Glad you got that petition done Ilias!
For those of you who don't know me, I am not a hippy, animals rights type of person, in fact I hate those guys! But I really can't stand that documentaries have been lowered to this level, killing animals for entertainment. To be honest, as much as it offends me, the killing of the animal is not my biggest concern. The way he talks about the boa constrictor before he kills it makes it sound like he is doing the world a service by killing this horrible creature. If he explains that the killing of the animal is necessary when lost in the wilderness, and is not something we should take pleasure in doing, I guess I would not hate him quite as much...
Like Michael, I am not too much of a fan of documentaries that involve Herpetologists who hold every deadly snake by the tail. But I did like Steve Irwin, because much of the millions he made went straight back into conservation, especially in situ projects in Australia and the Far East.
But in any case I have signed the petition because that show is garbage, and sadly many youngsters do take too much notice of what they see on TV!
Matt 

+1000 Matt 

and signed!

job well done and a great result of this topic! 

I agree with Michael. Am I the only one? 

> Instead, lets let them grow up with their parents showing
> off the large deer that they just
> shot sitting on their fat asses in a hide orq catching a > fish just for the sake of killing
> something.
Sounds like you had a horrible childhood, Michael ;-))). It is not a matter of “this” or “that”. Both are sad and senseless.

> Or even better, let them grow up without any show on
> nature so they will never care.
As TV has an educational role, regardless of the fact they like it or not, they should just make a decent wildlife show. Long live the BBC... Even their shows can annoy me sometimes, but the difference is huge.

> The basic fact is that nowadays, one has to provide
> something exiting to interest people on TV.
I refuse to accept this. Sensationalism is cheap and easy. Turning the kill of any animal by a Western presenter into a theme is avoidable, even if you insist on delivering "exciting" (or what I would call: crap) TV.

> Moreover, not all kids are brainless idiots. They grow
> up, get some education, and will
> hopefully learn how to rate what they see on TV.
After having flooded by that same medium, yes. Objectivity ? Kids are susceptible. In fact, people are. Many are brainless idiots, i.m.-not-so-h.o.

> If you think that this is not true, we should be
> concerned about hunting, not killing snakes
> with a stick, not?
The environmental impact of eating meat is much, much worse. That’s actually why I don’t really care all that much about this entire discussion, I’m afraid. 

But out of sympathy for Ilias and his initiative, I signed it ;-). 

>> Instead, lets let them grow up with their parents showing
>> off the large deer that they just
>> shot sitting on their fat asses in a hide orq catching a > fish just for the sake of killing
>> something.
>Sounds like you had a horrible childhood, Michael ;-))). It is not a matter of “this” or “that”. >Both are sad and senseless.

I prefer organic moose meat harvested by local hunters over Mc Donald's beef, and self-hunted grouse over industrially farmed chickens. Is that horrible, sad and senseless?

Jeroen and others, are you vegetarians? If not, you all support the industrial torture and killing of millions of animals for a reason of no real importance, so please don't cry about the killing of one animal being shown on TV.

After all, I think it's healthy for kids to see that animals actually have to be killed for their meat being eaten. 

Tom, we already discussed that. It's not about diet or protesting for animals being killed for being eaten. It's about the impact on wildlife and the useless killing of wild animals (not many left) just for TV numbers.

Jeroen, thanks :-) 

Tom, that is not the point, these wild animals are not being killed for wide scale human consumption, they are being killed so the arsehole presenter can get better ratings. And if I and everyone else on Euroherp were vegetarians it would not make a slight bit of difference to the treatment of animals for consumption, which is horrible but something that will not change. Many countries such as the UK are overpopulated so this fast, awful way of treating animals for consumption by the human inhabitants will sadly continue. The difference is, children will not want to go out and put chickens into solitary confinement as a leisure activity, or kick a cow around the head a few times before killing it to be consumed. With regard to this show he is going into a rainforest, killing what he finds, whilst at the same time telling people how dangerous and aggressive they are as he is either bashing them with a stick or plunging a knife into their heads. I know the killing of the odd animal is not going to have any affect on the species populations but it is THE WAY that he does it that will affect people. I work with the public everyday, and although there are a lot of nice children who are brought up correctly, there A LOT of children who are not and are quite brainless!!!! Sorry to say that but it is reality...
This Bear Grylls guy seemingly enjoys bashing animals over the head, he gets a thrill from jumping onto an adult alligator and plunged a knife into its skull. What is the sense in showing that on TV to a vulnerable audience??? Not that they are likely to jump onto an alligator, but some kids would be stupid enough!
Matt 

I have to agree with Ilias,Matt and Jeroen on this! And just to add - If idiots like Bear Grylls are shown on TV and there are lots of people watching it (which they do), this not only results in the afore-mentinoed "brainless kids copying" but also the creation of new similar shows! People will do everything for money and I won't be surprised if this type of "survival" shows are the only shows you would see on Discovery Channelif they continue to have this high rating. The other day I saw a new "survival" show in which two guys slaughtered an adult green iguana in front of the camera and ate it! I know local people eat them and it is normal, and that's how you get the meat out of an animal and bla,bla but it doesn't mean that everybody has to see how they kill them on TV. Humans are getting killed every day around the world, so this should be taken as normal too...why don't we show how to cut a humans head in 8:00 o'clock then..and let the kids decide if it's right or wrong for themselves! Don't think so! 

> why don't we show how to cut a humans
> head in 8:00 o'clock then

I like the idea: if we do this often enough, it might solve some problems... ;-) 

In fact, some years ago they did show how some men decapitated a soldier (close up shot, sound and everything) on Bulgarian national TV at 8:00 o'clock while people were dining! The director of the TV was directly fired! Unfortunately showing decapitation of animals doesn't cause that much attention! 

Guys I made this page at facebook http://www.facebook.com/pages/Stop-killing-wildlife-for-TV-shows/117426705018339

It would be nice to share it
Thanks!